Dictys Cretensis and other authors I hate...
I'm writing in English today because I am just so tired of Latin. I've been working on preparing for the big Latin exam next Friday by going over previous exams. There is one passage which is just pissing me off because I can't figure out what's going on.
Here's part of the passage, it's from the September 1991 exam and it is written by dude named Dictys Cretensis.
Stupid Latin Passage
Ulysses challanges the Trojans
Post quem Ulixes medius adstand huiuscemodi orationem habuit: credo ego vos, Troiani principes, satis compertum habere, nihil temere Graecos, nihil inconsultum incipere solere, ac semper his iam tum a maioribus provisum atque elaboratum, uti facta gestaque eorum laus potius quam culpa sequeretur.
Et ut praeterita bene consulta omittam, iam hoc licet recognoscere. Iniuriis contumeliisque Alexandri paulo ante laesa Graecia non ad vim neque ad arma decursum est, quod iracundia refugium esse solet. Nam de consilii sententia legati ad recipiendam Helenam, ut meministis, cum Menelao venimus. Quibus praeter superbas verborum minas et insidias occultas nihil a Priamo neque ab eius regulis remissum est. Imperfecta igitur re, ut opinor, consequens fuit arma capere hisque per vim extorquere, quod amice impetrari nequitum est iataque parato exercitu ac tot egregiis atque inclitis ducibus ne sic quidem proelium adversum vos inire consilium fuit, sed imitati morem modestiamque solitam iterato ad vos ob eandem causam oratum venimus.
My rotten translation:
After which, Ulysses, standing in the middle, gave a speech of this manner: I believe you, Trojan Princes, that you have enough evidence that the Greeks are accustomed to do nothing rashly, nothing which has not been thought through, and always do things which have been labored on and provided for them by their elders, so much that praise more than blame follows their acts and deeds.
For starters, I have no idea why "medius" is in the nominative. Shouldn't it be "in medio adstans"? I won't complain too much about that one because the meaning is still obvious. However, what the **** is going on with the the "his"? Is it supposed to go off of the provisum (which can take the dative when it means "provided for" rather than "forseen"). That's how I took it in my translation but it just doesn't make sense. They only do things provided for them by their elders? What the hell does that mean? Maybe it's supposed to go with the elders? But that doesn't make sense either.
And to pass over these past consultations well, it is permitted now to recognize them.
What does this mean? I have no idea. This is a weird sentence. "omittam" might be omit, let go, disregard. I think what he's trying to say is the first step to overcoming your fear of the meticulous planning of the Greeks is to first recognize them. Unfortunately, Dictys doesn't say that. If that's what he meant then he's a dick because he could have said it clearer.
A little while before Greece was battered by the injuries and indignaties of Alexander, there was not a rush to strength, nor to arms, which was accustomed to be a refuge of passion.
I don't understand this, isn't Alexander Greek?
For according to the wisdom of the counsel, we came as ambassadors , as you remember, to recieve Helen. To which, nothing was returned by Priam or his men except proud threats of words and hidden treacheries.
You thought you would trick me Dictys, by putting legati looking like a genitive over sententia, but oh no, oh no...
Therefore, with this business unfinished, in my opinion, it followed to take up arms and with those arms, to extort through strength what was unable to be obtained by friendly means. So therefore, with the army prepared and with so many distinguished and famous leaders, there was no plan to go to battle against you,
Ok, this doesn't make sense...the army is prepared, but there is no plan? Whose army the Greeks or the Trojans? And is Ulysses still giving a history lesson or has he switched to the present?
...but with this having happened a second time, imitating their character and known modesty, we come to you to beseach you against the same cause.
All I can say is, you tried Dictys with that supine, you tried, but you couldn't fool me. The rest of it though is hogwash.
If anyone has a better way of translating this let me know.
Cheers, (uel ualete,)
Christian
Here's part of the passage, it's from the September 1991 exam and it is written by dude named Dictys Cretensis.
Stupid Latin Passage
Ulysses challanges the Trojans
Post quem Ulixes medius adstand huiuscemodi orationem habuit: credo ego vos, Troiani principes, satis compertum habere, nihil temere Graecos, nihil inconsultum incipere solere, ac semper his iam tum a maioribus provisum atque elaboratum, uti facta gestaque eorum laus potius quam culpa sequeretur.
Et ut praeterita bene consulta omittam, iam hoc licet recognoscere. Iniuriis contumeliisque Alexandri paulo ante laesa Graecia non ad vim neque ad arma decursum est, quod iracundia refugium esse solet. Nam de consilii sententia legati ad recipiendam Helenam, ut meministis, cum Menelao venimus. Quibus praeter superbas verborum minas et insidias occultas nihil a Priamo neque ab eius regulis remissum est. Imperfecta igitur re, ut opinor, consequens fuit arma capere hisque per vim extorquere, quod amice impetrari nequitum est iataque parato exercitu ac tot egregiis atque inclitis ducibus ne sic quidem proelium adversum vos inire consilium fuit, sed imitati morem modestiamque solitam iterato ad vos ob eandem causam oratum venimus.
My rotten translation:
After which, Ulysses, standing in the middle, gave a speech of this manner: I believe you, Trojan Princes, that you have enough evidence that the Greeks are accustomed to do nothing rashly, nothing which has not been thought through, and always do things which have been labored on and provided for them by their elders, so much that praise more than blame follows their acts and deeds.
For starters, I have no idea why "medius" is in the nominative. Shouldn't it be "in medio adstans"? I won't complain too much about that one because the meaning is still obvious. However, what the **** is going on with the the "his"? Is it supposed to go off of the provisum (which can take the dative when it means "provided for" rather than "forseen"). That's how I took it in my translation but it just doesn't make sense. They only do things provided for them by their elders? What the hell does that mean? Maybe it's supposed to go with the elders? But that doesn't make sense either.
And to pass over these past consultations well, it is permitted now to recognize them.
What does this mean? I have no idea. This is a weird sentence. "omittam" might be omit, let go, disregard. I think what he's trying to say is the first step to overcoming your fear of the meticulous planning of the Greeks is to first recognize them. Unfortunately, Dictys doesn't say that. If that's what he meant then he's a dick because he could have said it clearer.
A little while before Greece was battered by the injuries and indignaties of Alexander, there was not a rush to strength, nor to arms, which was accustomed to be a refuge of passion.
I don't understand this, isn't Alexander Greek?
For according to the wisdom of the counsel, we came as ambassadors , as you remember, to recieve Helen. To which, nothing was returned by Priam or his men except proud threats of words and hidden treacheries.
You thought you would trick me Dictys, by putting legati looking like a genitive over sententia, but oh no, oh no...
Therefore, with this business unfinished, in my opinion, it followed to take up arms and with those arms, to extort through strength what was unable to be obtained by friendly means. So therefore, with the army prepared and with so many distinguished and famous leaders, there was no plan to go to battle against you,
Ok, this doesn't make sense...the army is prepared, but there is no plan? Whose army the Greeks or the Trojans? And is Ulysses still giving a history lesson or has he switched to the present?
...but with this having happened a second time, imitating their character and known modesty, we come to you to beseach you against the same cause.
All I can say is, you tried Dictys with that supine, you tried, but you couldn't fool me. The rest of it though is hogwash.
If anyone has a better way of translating this let me know.
Cheers, (uel ualete,)
Christian
2 Comments:
Wow.... Latin... Its amazing to see someone writing it. Good work. Keep up with it.
And here's something that I can write in latin:
Per aspera ad astra. (you probably know the meaning of that, right?)
And another one:
Furnulum pani nolo - I don't want a toaster
LOL.
-Anme
By .Azure.Sky., at 1:44 PM
Hei!
Thanks for stoping by! It's nice to hear from someone as far away as Finland.
Hauska tavata sinua!Toivon tapaavani sinut uudestaan.
Christian
By Christian, at 3:35 PM
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